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[bryant]

A lot of people are saying that Michael Jordan had the best year ever for a 40 year old NBA player, and I guess I gotta agree with that. Look at these numbers: .483 from the field, .363 from three point range, .826 from the stripe, 7.7 assists and 1.7 steals per game in a mere 27.7 minutes…

Oh, sorry. That’s John Stockton at 40. OK, OK.

Shooting .462 from the field, with 7.8 rebounds per game, 4.7 assists, and 20.6 points per game, it’s… damn it. Karl Malone.

Jordan, bless his indecisive little heart, shot .445 from the field, .291 from three point range, .821 from the stripe, had 6.1 rebounds per game, 3.8 assists per game, and 1.5 steals per game. An even 20 points per game, too.

If I’m choosing up teams, I think Malone has it by a whisker or two. He won’t hit as many three pointers for you, but the rest of his game is clearly better. Malone doesn’t actually turn 40 until July 24th, but there’s no reason to think he couldn’t turn in about the same numbers next year; the guy keeps in shape.

The Stockton/Jordan choice is more difficult, because they fulfill such different roles. Still, Stockton is a better shooter despite playing the position that doesn’t demand good shooting, and 7.7 assists per game! At his age! In fairly limited minutes! Insane skills. I think in general you want to fill the PG slot before the SG slot, too, so I pick Stockton over Jordan. And Stockton is a legitimate 40, so there you go.

Comments

[carneggy.livejournal.com]

Going to take a little exception here.

Malone almost certainly won't do as well next year. If you look, his last 4 seasons have shown a decrease every year in points, rebounds, and blocks - there's no reason to expect these to get *better*, especially if he does move to another team where he's certain to not be the first scoring option. Still, solid numbers.

Stockton vs. Jordan, in my opinion, isn't even close. Stockton certainly has impressive assists for limited minutes, and he's ahead of Jordan in steals. A little ahead in FG & FT percentage. But that's it. Jordan is up in points, minutes, fouls, turnovers, rebounds, blocks, and 3-point shots made.
Heck, he had less fouls and less turnovers BEFORE increasing Stockton's amount to match minutes played.

Don't get me wrong - Stockton is still an incredibly gifted player, who can clearly keep going for a few more years. But no way do I want a PG who can't score, and can't really do anything special but get assists, over a SG who scores in buckets and is one of the best rebounders at his position in the league. (Stockton was top-5 in assists in the league; Jordan's the 7th best rebounding guard.)

One also has to wonder how well Stockton would rack up assists without dominant scorers to pass to. The Wizards really were pretty talentless this year outside Jordan. The top 2 DC assists people were the SG's (Jordan and Stackhouse); Jordan missed being his team's leading rebounder by less than 1/game (to Christian Laettner, of all people).

All three would still be fine additions to a club. Odds are Stockton and Malone will play on next year. But I think Jordan had a notably better season than Stockton, and I'm not sure Malone will do comparably well next year. If he can, his numbers should be a wash with Jordan's for 'best 40-year old season'.

[bryant]

It gets tricky when you talk about situational stuff. Let's hit Stockton first...

I think you're right that Stockton wouldn't rack up as many assists without Malone to pass to, but he's playing with the team that he's playing with. I could as easily say that Jordan wouldn't rack up as many points if he was playing on a team that had any other scorers. One of my fundamental NBA beliefs is that scoring 20 points a game on a team where you're the first option is not all that hard. Thus, I tend to discount Jordan's 20 ppg a little bit.

His rebounds, admittedly, are impressive.

Bigger issue, though -- isn't "getting assists" exactly what a PG is supposed to be good at? If you have a PG with a lot of assists and a good TO/assist ratio -- which Stockton has -- you have a good PG. Stockton is not a primary scoring option but he is very much capable of taking shots when needed, and he's close to a sure thing from the line, which is huge. Put differently: how many teams in the NBA wouldn't take his stat line from their starting PG?

You can't really fault Stockton on turnovers; he's handling the ball more. You expect your PG to have higher TO numbers. The key is the ratio. Stockton's is much much better.

The biggest issue in the Stockton comparison in my eyes is actually minutes; it's not clear that Stockton could play bigger minutes. (If he did, kick him up to around 10 assists and 15 points per game...) But I think it's a close comparison even so.

OK. Malone's FG% rose a little this year compared to last year; both are down from his career average, though. His rebounding was up last year compared to 2001, and is down this year compared to last year and 2001 both. Assists are up marginally and he's above his career average this year. Turnovers dropped a lot this year, and are distinctly under his career average. I expect he'll be a little worse in all categories next year; much worse if he plays with the Lakers.

But really, it's the sheer hero worship of the original comment that gets me. I find it disrespectful of what Malone and Stockton have accomplished. Jordan's had an incredible season, and some of his games this year were masterpieces... but you know, Malone had a 40 point game. Seven 30 point games. Came within 2 assists of a triple double twice, came within 3 rebounds of another one once. If he'd retired, then come back to post those numbers people would notice. As is, it's simply expected.

[carneggy.livejournal.com]

If you check the stats, you'll notice Jordan wasn't even the high scorer on his team - they did actually have another scoring option.

I don't think it is remotely disrespectable of Malone, since the original hero-worshpi statement can't apply to him since he's not 40 yet. He's not really even relevant to this discussion except for his potential for next year.

It's certainly a little disrespectful of Stockton, but Stockton's basically been platooning all year, which doesn't really indicate that he's still the full-time quality player he used to be.

I agree that many teams would want Stockton at PG. Then again, many teams would want Jordan at SF, too...